Interest rates, next 10 years.

User Forum Topic
Submitted by scaredyclassic on June 3, 2020 - 9:01pm

Thinking about taking loans for some of my last kids college.

1.5 to 2% variable.

Pretty low.

I figure if it goes up i can just pay it.

At 1.5 perc. Though, i think id rather stay liquid.

I assumed rates would be high by now, but im thinking if anything they're going down?

Submitted by Coronita on June 3, 2020 - 9:43pm.

Is there a cap on the variable rate?

There's a high probability of student loan debt forgiveness in the future, so why not.

Submitted by zk on June 3, 2020 - 11:36pm.

Coronita wrote:
Is there a cap on the variable rate?

There's a high probability of student loan debt forgiveness in the future, so why not.

I don't think the 1.5% loan he's talking about is a student loan.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. I would be down for that.

If it's not a student loan, what kind of loan is it?

If it is a student loan, what kind of student loan is it?

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 7:33pm.

Well this opens up an interesting situation.

Being the over prepared parent as I am, I had budgeted a 529 But I wonder how this would work if I take out a student loan for my kid. Could the 529 be used to pay for a student loan?

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 7:21am.

Yes, you can use a 529 to pay a student loan, but only up to $10k per lifetime per person.

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/pe...

Submitted by scaredyclassic on June 4, 2020 - 7:38am.

zk wrote:
Coronita wrote:
Is there a cap on the variable rate?

There's a high probability of student loan debt forgiveness in the future, so why not.

I don't think the 1.5% loan he's talking about is a student loan.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. I would be down for that.

If it's not a student loan, what kind of loan is it?

If it is a student loan, what kind of student loan is it?

Sallie maes website currently says as low as 1.49 variable student loans. I havent read the fine pront.

https://www.salliemae.com/

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 12:10pm.

scaredyclassic wrote:
zk wrote:
Coronita wrote:
Is there a cap on the variable rate?

There's a high probability of student loan debt forgiveness in the future, so why not.

I don't think the 1.5% loan he's talking about is a student loan.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. I would be down for that.

If it's not a student loan, what kind of loan is it?

If it is a student loan, what kind of student loan is it?

Sallie maes website currently says as low as 1.49 variable student loans. I havent read the fine pront.

https://www.salliemae.com/

So I'm curious about this, since it's going to be something on my mind in 4-5 years. The thing I find disturbing though.... It's really hard to find the fine print concerning the 1.25% variable rate loan, beyond that you must have some auto-pay feature enabled to get the lowest rate.

That in itself is troubling for me. If the offer was really good, the fine print should be easily found....

Why do I get the feeling that student loans are as predatory as credit cards....

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 12:36pm.

You are in for a treat...Real time chat with a Sallie Mae agent since none of the details of that 1.25% variable rate loan I could find anywhere... And so far, the agent isn't being clear about it either... (Fake name Frank used)

..
.
.
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Info at 12:10, Jun 4:
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Info at 12:10, Jun 4:
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Automated Advisor at 12:10, Jun 4:
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Automated Advisor at 12:10, Jun 4:
What can I help you with today?

frank at 12:10, Jun 4:
Where can i find the fine print for the 1.25% variable rate loan?
Automated Advisor at 12:10, Jun 4:
Your question will help me improve, but I don't have that answer. Please be patient while I connect you to our next available Sales Specialist. Our wait times are currently longer than usual.

Info at 12:11, Jun 4:
Please wait while your chat is transferred to the appropriate group.
Info at 12:11, Jun 4:
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frank at 12:11, Jun 4:
It seems like the details of the 1.25% variable rate loan is intentionally not easily found.
frank at 12:11, Jun 4:
Why>
Danielle at 12:11, Jun 4:
Thank you for using Sallie Mae Live Chat. You are now chatting with a Live Specialist.
Can you please elaborate what details you are looking for?
frank at 12:12, Jun 4:
I want to know how long is the 1.25% rate last, what is the maximum APR (is it capped), etc...you know the usually things that someone that's going to take out a variable loan wants to know about that many lenders intentionally hide.
frank at 12:12, Jun 4:
Also any pre-payment penalties.
frank at 12:13, Jun 4:
There's got to be some terms and conditions document.
Danielle at 12:13, Jun 4:
Your specific rate will vary based on the loan product selected. If your loan offers rate and repayment options, your rate may also vary based on your selection.
If your loan has a variable rate, the maximum interest rate your loan could adjust to is 25%.
Danielle at 12:13, Jun 4:
There is no prepayment penalty.
frank at 12:13, Jun 4:
How is the variable rate indexed
frank at 12:13, Jun 4:
how does it change
frank at 12:13, Jun 4:
Let's say I qualify for the 1.25% apr rate
frank at 12:14, Jun 4:
(I will)
frank at 12:14, Jun 4:
How long does my rate stay 1.25%
Danielle at 12:14, Jun 4:
It is based off the one month LIBOR. Our variable rate index is based on the one-month LIBOR and can change on a monthly basis on the 25th of each month.
Danielle at 12:14, Jun 4:
If you choose variable, it can potentially be for just one month.
frank at 12:15, Jun 4:
So is it always libor + (rate amount)
frank at 12:15, Jun 4:
is the (rate amount) always the same
frank at 12:15, Jun 4:
or can that change?
frank at 12:15, Jun 4:
Assuming I always pay on time
Danielle at 12:16, Jun 4:
I'm not sure what you mean by will it always be libor plus rate amount. The rate will be based off the LIBOR. Interest rates are calculated by our system based on your creditworthiness and/or application data. An applicant’s creditworthiness takes into
account factors such as:

- A positive payment history;
- Length of time since credit was established; and
- Amount of outstanding debt.
frank at 12:17, Jun 4:
Understood. Let's use an example. I have close to an 800 credit score, I have $100k/year annual income I always pay on time.
frank at 12:18, Jun 4:
I take out a loan loan for $100k on /62020 at 1.25%
frank at 12:18, Jun 4:
libor states constant
frank at 12:18, Jun 4:
for the next 4 years
frank at 12:18, Jun 4:
What is my loan rate look like over the next 4 years.
Danielle at 12:19, Jun 4:
Since income was mentioned, I do need to state you do not need to reveal alimony, child support, or separate maintenance income if you do not wish to have it considered as a basis for loan repayment. The only way to know what rate you would receive is to apply. I can collect some information to go over a range of rates but that is as specific as we can get. I would not be able to say what it would look like over the next four years. You can see history of the LIBOR at bankrate.com .
frank at 12:20, Jun 4:
I just want to understand what are the factors that would make the variable rate increase if libor rate stays constant, I always pay on time, my credit score and income doesn't change.
frank at 12:21, Jun 4:
(IE, is this 1.25% only a teaser rate...)
Danielle at 12:21, Jun 4:
If LIBOR stays constant, it should not change. Once a variable rate is received, it will only change when LIBOR does.
frank at 12:21, Jun 4:
All this would be clear in a document that mysteriously is absent on any website.
frank at 12:22, Jun 4:
Current libor rate is 1.80%
frank at 12:22, Jun 4:
Your offer is 1.25%
frank at 12:22, Jun 4:
Are you saying that the variable rate will always be -0.55% libor, assuming nothing else about me changes?

Danielle at 12:23, Jun 4:
I cannot guarantee that. It is LIBOR plus a margin. I cannot know what rate you will receive or all the ways it can possibly change. We are here to answer questions about the loan products and process but we are not credit experts or financial advisors.
frank at 12:25, Jun 4:

Do you have a document that describes the loan terms that i can read
frank at 12:26, Jun 4:
So basically you are saying that margin above/below libor could change anytime, even if nothing with my financial/credit worthiness changes?
frank at 12:27, Jun 4:
I'm just trying to understand under what circumstances it would change if my financial/credit worthiness does not change.

Danielle at 12:29, Jun 4:
I'll be right with you.
frank at 12:29, Jun 4:
k

frank at 12:29, Jun 4:
k
Danielle at 12:30, Jun 4:
If your financial/credit worthiness does not change, the only reason it would change is LIBOR. I cannot state how much it will change or what it will look like in four years. There is a calculator you can play around with under college planning and then Tools. There is not a document that describes the loan terms as there are multiple variables such as the loan product, the LIBOR, if you make payments early ( there is no prepayment penalty), if there was a late payment. If nothing in your credit changes, the variable rate should only change with LIBOR.
frank at 12:31, Jun 4:
Is that a guarantee? That if my credit/finances does not change and I always pay on time, and libor does not change, then my loan rate should never change from 1.25%?

Danielle at 12:32, Jun 4:
It is not guaranteed.

frank at 12:33, Jun 4:
Ok..... So dumb question. Could you give me one example of how my rate could change even if my credit/finances does not change, I always pay on time, libor does not change?

Danielle at 12:35, Jun 4:
Our rates are among the most competitive in the private student loan market and we work to ensure that all our customers receive a fair and competitive price.
From time to time, our pricing criteria may change based on the current market, rate environment, and other factors. Changes to your credit history and/or application data can also affect your rate.
frank at 12:35, Jun 4:
Sorry, again if there was a document that describes this, it would be a lot easier for me to understand. I'm financially literate, but I can't imagine for most of the people who are not, how they could ever understand these terms.

Submitted by scaredyclassic on June 4, 2020 - 12:37pm.

I wonder if this violates any truth in lending laws.

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 12:37pm.

Frank at 12:37, Jun 4:
Can you give me an example i the past where a loan rate has changed because the "pricing criteria" changed, but libor didn't change, and the person's financial/credit worthiness did not change?
frank at 12:37, Jun 4:
(in the past)

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 12:38pm.

God damnit they seem to be dancing around the same damn question for a long time... I'm still on the chat channel with them...

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 12:39pm.

Danielle at 12:38, Jun 4:
We would not have that information available. Once an application is submitted, if approved, you will receive an interest rate offer. If you choose variable, it can increase or decrease over the life of the loan. I cannot say every factor that may contribute to a change. Your specific rate will vary based on the loan product selected. If your loan offers rate and repayment options, your rate may also vary based on your selection.
If your loan has a variable rate, the maximum interest rate your loan could adjust to is 25%.

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 12:43pm.

Danielle at 12:38, Jun 4:
We would not have that information available. Once an application is submitted, if approved, you will receive an interest rate offer. If you choose variable, it can increase or decrease over the life of the loan. I cannot say every factor that may contribute to a change. Your specific rate will vary based on the loan product selected. If your loan offers rate and repayment options, your rate may also vary based on your selection.
If your loan has a variable rate, the maximum interest rate your loan could adjust to is 25%.
frank at 12:41, Jun 4:
Wow... So let me summarize how this loan works. You want me to apply for a variable loan that starts at 1.25% and is capped at 25% (credit card bend over rate), without any detailed description on how that variable rate could rise from 1.25% to somewhere 25%, even if nothing in my credit/financial situation changes, nor if libor changes, and if I always pay on time.....
frank at 12:41, Jun 4:
I'm sorry to say this, this is absolutely the worst loan idea ever. Probably worse than any used car loan or credit card offer, because at lease with those loans, if I'm going to bend over, at least I'm told up front.
frank at 12:42, Jun 4:
Thank you.
frank at 12:42, Jun 4:
But no thank you.

(agent disconnected before I could finish)

Danielle at 12:42, Jun 4:
Thank you for choosing Sallie Mae. To start an application, click here. To complete a brief survey about your chat experience, click here.

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 12:46pm.

So there you go scardey...

(You're welcome...)

I'm really disappointed she disconnected before I had a chance to send her the link to this thread. Damnit!

I know, I know... Such an ahole FLU thing to do...

But someone's got to do it!

Submitted by scaredyclassic on June 4, 2020 - 12:52pm.

Coronita wrote:
So there you go scardey...

(You're welcome...)

I'm really disappointed she disconnected before I had a chance to send her the link to this thread. Damnit!

I know, I know... Such an ahole FLU thing to do...

But someone's got to do it!

thanks

this is probably illegal for everyone but Sallie Mae to do.

I hate student loans. hate them with a seething passion. I recently paid mine off after 25 years. that includes a few very shaky bad years toward the beginning of the loan period. I mean, being a responsible fellow, it actually took a toll on my health.

But i didnt want to let my prejudice stand in the way of a screaming deal, if that's what this was.

my hatred continues to burn unabated. motherfuckers! if there were a way to riot and loot against student loans, i might. but it's like railing against capitalism, or the sun. it's justa fixture of reality.

curse you, sun, we need more moon!

Submitted by gzz on June 4, 2020 - 12:59pm.

I am somewhat familiar with the various student loan forgiveness programs, I don't think any of them apply to private loans taken by parents.

6% loan by student that might be forgiven seems better than 1.5% by parent that can't.

I used the direct loan/stafford program, entirely my loans not parents. They were 2 to 4% when taken out, and the "subsidized" ones just meant no interest while I was in school. When I graduated, I consolidated them into a direct loan at 2.8% 30 year direct loan. (One year I got a 5k 5% loan direct from my university which I paid off immediately upon working because of the high rate).

My entire debt of about 100k at graduation could have been forgiven by working for either the government at any level, OR a non-profit, OR simply by being poor. None of those ultimately applied, but the chance of one of them applying to your child is decent, not to mention additional programs.

During the start-up phase of my business, I deferred and capitalized all my payments for about 2.5 years. It took about 3 minutes to make the request online, and it amounted to about a 10k startup loan at 2.8%.

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 1:12pm.

scaredyclassic wrote:
Coronita wrote:
So there you go scardey...

(You're welcome...)

I'm really disappointed she disconnected before I had a chance to send her the link to this thread. Damnit!

I know, I know... Such an ahole FLU thing to do...

But someone's got to do it!

thanks

this is probably illegal for everyone but Sallie Mae to do.

I hate student loans. hate them with a seething passion. I recently paid mine off after 25 years. that includes a few very shaky bad years toward the beginning of the loan period. I mean, being a responsible fellow, it actually took a toll on my health.

But i didnt want to let my prejudice stand in the way of a screaming deal, if that's what this was.

my hatred continues to burn unabated. motherfuckers! if there were a way to riot and loot against student loans, i might. but it's like railing against capitalism, or the sun. it's justa fixture of reality.

curse you, sun, we need more moon!

You know....After just painfully enduring a 20 minute conversation with this legalized gangster of an organization Sallie Mae, of which I really want my 20 minutes of my life back... I have to say. Now I understand why there's so many people demanding financial reform for student loans.

This really is bad. I mean, if they want to try to pull this shit off to someone like me, who although I'm not the most financially smart, but at least financially competent, I can imagine how the majority of people in this country who are financially illiterate would get screwed over by a student loan. I mean, in so many ways, this is 10x worse than trying to get a used car loan or the interest rate terms of a credit card, because at least you can get a document that describes exactly how you're going to get screwed over for those two types of loans.

Add me to the camp of people who hate student loans (even though I never got one).

Really really fucked up.

If you really want your kid to pay his/her own way, maybe the way to do it is to cash out refinance a property at the current 2.5%-3%, and then loan the money to your kid, where he/she can make payments. At least then, you know the kid gets a fair loan rate.

Still a bit shocked at what just happened.

Submitted by scaredyclassic on June 4, 2020 - 2:11pm.

gzz wrote:
I am somewhat familiar with the various student loan forgiveness programs, I don't think any of them apply to private loans taken by parents.

6% loan by student that might be forgiven seems better than 1.5% by parent that can't.

I used the direct loan/stafford program, entirely my loans not parents. They were 2 to 4% when taken out, and the "subsidized" ones just meant no interest while I was in school. When I graduated, I consolidated them into a direct loan at 2.8% 30 year direct loan. (One year I got a 5k 5% loan direct from my university which I paid off immediately upon working because of the high rate).

My entire debt of about 100k at graduation could have been forgiven by working for either the government at any level, OR a non-profit, OR simply by being poor. None of those ultimately applied, but the chance of one of them applying to your child is decent, not to mention additional programs.

During the start-up phase of my business, I deferred and capitalized all my payments for about 2.5 years. It took about 3 minutes to make the request online, and it amounted to about a 10k startup loan at 2.8%.

interesting.

but it's absolutely terrible that one has to make all these unknowable calculations on the odds of your kids various trajectories to figure whether it's better to pay upfront or have him borrow and backstop him.

i mean, jeez. it's kind of a start up loan; but not really. it's a giant hole society dug for you that you were stuck in and they agreed not to throw dirt on your face for a while, as long as you agreed to deepen the hole, but fortunately not that much, just 2.8% deeper a year

boogaloo. blm. maybe there's just a general sense of rage at a society that feels predatory. I m not saying theres an equivalence between student loans and police killigns...but maybe theres a connection

Submitted by gzz on June 4, 2020 - 3:47pm.

I.m not saying there's an equivalence between student loans and police killings

Free college increases inequality. We all think about the poor kid who uses college to reach the middle class who would benefit from free college.

The reality is such situation is rare, and people from truly poor and working class families who are college material have a lot of cheap college options already between the GI Bill, private scholarships, Pell Grants, community college + scholarship to cheap state school. But they mostly don't go to college at all because their friends and family didn't, and they do not enjoy school enough to want to continue it further.

The main impact of free college would be upper middle class people who graduate with 50-100k in debt and then earn top 10 or 20% incomes would be 50-100k richer when they graduate (or their parents would have another 50-100k).

Submitted by Ready2Invest on June 4, 2020 - 4:25pm.

Thank you for your sacrifice @conornita - very valuable lesson

Submitted by scaredyclassic on June 4, 2020 - 5:31pm.

gzz wrote:

I.m not saying there's an equivalence between student loans and police killings

Free college increases inequality. We all think about the poor kid who uses college to reach the middle class who would benefit from free college.

The reality is such situation is rare, and people from truly poor and working class families who are college material have a lot of cheap college options already between the GI Bill, private scholarships, Pell Grants, community college + scholarship to cheap state school. But they mostly don't go to college at all because their friends and family didn't, and they do not enjoy school enough to want to continue it further.

The main impact of free college would be upper middle class people who graduate with 50-100k in debt and then earn top 10 or 20% incomes would be 50-100k richer when they graduate (or their parents would have another 50-100k).

i guess im getting pretty cheap, but every 18 to 22 year old is broke.

why does society expect me to pay for my adult kids? seriously. These arent kids. these are adults.

it was different when the numbers werent so large, maybe, like if I had to cough up a few extra bucks.

i could earn a years tuition at a state univ over the summer in 1981

now...

it's not like a little extra help. 100-300k is actual money.

so you see bumperstickers like, my kid and all my money go to stanford univ.

in general, we tell people, your parents money is not your money. dont count on it, dont expect anything, if they want to help you they will, but it's theirs not yours.

yet with college, that goes out the window. kids and society expect you to pay.

your wealth is their wealth for aid purposes, and really just an expectation ofsupport.

why?
yeah, if college were free, the middle class kid will be richer if he got free college in a strictly accounting way.

but

I dont really think of being debt-free as being "richer". are kids really "rich" if they get out of school with no debt?

is a homeless guy with 38 cents richer than a guy 300k in the hole with credit cards maxed out and a benz in his driveway?

just that statement makes me want to barf a little.

yeah i get that one has more potential than the other...

but i think it's just that everyone at least start at zero. that seems reasonable. debt feels awful.

having been hobbled with 6 figure debt, with a supposedly lucrative degree, i still found it difficult to make it, i dont want my kdis in debt, i dont want to pay, i dont like the system, and it doesnt seem very fair overall.

IN other news, im cranky, frustrated, tired, i feel old, I'm losing my hair, everything seems like bullshit, i'm sick of the state of the union and im distressed about the state of the world, i dont think things are going to be ok, I need a haircut and I'm scared to be near other people.

also im completely full of shit because my parents paid cash to send me to an ivy league college.

but they didnt pay 4 law school...so maybe im just half full of shit?

i thnk Im going to put in my advance directive that if i
start watching fox news, I want all life support measures including food and water and oxygen, withheld from me. let me die. hopefully i pull out of this funk.

Submitted by Coronita on June 4, 2020 - 8:03pm.

scaredyclassic wrote:

i guess im getting pretty cheap, but every 18 to 22 year old is broke.

why does society expect me to pay for my adult kids? seriously. These arent kids. these are adults.

it was different when the numbers werent so large, maybe, like if I had to cough up a few extra bucks.

i could earn a years tuition at a state univ over the summer in 1981

now...

it's not like a little extra help. 100-300k is actual money.

College tuition is one of the few things that has consistently increased by 4% every year. Think about that one.

Quote:

so you see bumperstickers like, my kid and all my money go to stanford univ.

Funny you should say that because the first week I got into college, I bought a sticker and gave it to my dad that says exactly that....I got a full ride from Bank of Parents who paid for it because of his speculation in the 80ies into then unknown semiconductor company called "Intel"

Quote:

in general, we tell people, your parents money is not your money. dont count on it, dont expect anything, if they want to help you they will, but it's theirs not yours.

Many parents only tell our kids that so they don't turn out to be entitled spoiled brats. And that's the reality. But it's a systemic problem we have here in the U.S. even well before college..

Money in some cases does make a non-trival difference in someone's education here in the US. And that's fucked up.

Take something as simple as the SAT/ACT . Parents that can afford to send kids to take the SAT/ACT multiple times at $100 a pop, and the more times one takes it, the better the score is. we can sign them up for a multiple prep classes so they can score higher. And parents know that now. That's why getting a kid into a top rank school or even a UC school these days is almost like an arm's race, where the parent that spends the most money arming their kid with the best tutors, extracuricular activities in name only, recommendation, essay writing, etc wins....I have a huge problem with these "college specialists" these days that pretty much offer strategic ways for kids to apply, how to write their essays (even possibly doing it for them), etc. It wasn't nearly this bad when I was applying for colleges....But admittedly, since this is the game that it has come to, and for a family that can play this game, of course they are going to pay up and play this game. It frankly makes me sick. and totally turned off I hate this game.

That ain't right. Anytime you put a huge dollar on whether someone gets into a a reputable college program, that immediately means you aren't always going to get the best and brightest students, because there is a good percentage of the population that would have been good but couldn't afford to go. That's fucked up. In most Asian countries, people test to get into the best schools, and the best schools are almost free to anyone who test in and meet the stringent requirements, regardless of economic background they are from. Private schools are tier 2,3,4 level schools for students who don't do as well. In a lot of way, this makes sense because this gives people from poor(er) backgrounds an opportunity to get out of their financial state simply by being academically talented/capable. And those that aren't as talented but are from families with reasonable amount of money can afford to send their kids to a decent private school and still turn out pretty good

We don't do it here. Everything a kid needs to do to get into a top rank college, the kid has a better change when their parents have money.

Quote:

yeah, if college were free, the middle class kid will be richer if he got free college in a strictly accounting way.

College into a top rank school, one could consider, is a limited resource. Not everyone should be able to get in for "free". There should be some weeding out process, so that "free" applies to top talent irrespective of financial background. I don't have a problem if tax dollars are used to groom the best and brightest here in the U.S. I also don't think these top rank schools should be free foreign students. We're not responsible for raising top foreign talent. And most of the time, top talent from foreign countries have a free ride from their respective governments that end up paying for their tuition. In fact, imho, we should be charging much more for foreign students since most likely countries will end up paying, if their eventual purpose is to repatriate the students the send overseas here to the U.S.

Quote:

but i think it's just that everyone at least start at zero. that seems reasonable. debt feels awful.

Yup.

Quote:

having been hobbled with 6 figure debt, with a supposedly lucrative degree, i still found it difficult to make it, i dont want my kdis in debt, i dont want to pay, i dont like the system, and it doesnt seem very fair overall.

I think I mentioned this before but there are a lot of doctors and dentists that are part time employees for other doctors and dentists and won't be having their practices for a long time....Why? Because when they graduated from medical school and dental school, they were in a hole for $500-600k.

On top of that, if they wanted to start their own practice, who's going to loan them the money?

The ones that are able to start their own practice right away tend to be financed by Bank of Parents who were also doctors and dentists...

But good news. For most careers, eventually, the degree from a specific college really doesn't matter. I have yet to work with many people from an Ivy League school. My expensive paper, however, looks very nice..Might double up as spare toilet paper. That's about it.

Also, we have a few programs that other countries dont have. For instance, serving in the armed forces is a great way also pay for higher education.

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