Can't afford Carmel Valley? No problem....

User Forum Topic
Submitted by Coronita on May 8, 2015 - 9:00pm

....Own part of a home....5 weeks each year for $450000!!!!!

https://www.redfin.com/CA/San-Diego/5324...

Includes golf membership!

($1130/month HOA not included)

Submitted by svelte on May 8, 2015 - 9:37pm.

I have no desire to live in Carmel Valley. It's another one of those places I just don't understand.

Submitted by Coronita on May 8, 2015 - 9:43pm.

svelte wrote:
I have no desire to live in Carmel Valley. It's another one of those places I just don't understand.

Well, to be honest. I don't get part of this area either...

Submitted by njtosd on May 8, 2015 - 11:09pm.

svelte wrote:
I have no desire to live in Carmel Valley. It's another one of those places I just don't understand.

Well - it's not a place I would live if I didn't have school aged kids. But since I do, Carmel Valley is easy to understand. Schools are routinely ranked top in the county (son attends CCA which, last I checked, has the highest test scores in SD, plus an arts conservatory, etc). Motivated kids attract good teachers. Low crime, close to the ocean. Almost all the other residents have school aged kids, so there's a good likelihood that your kids will have friends living close. Most of those kids are VERY academically motivated, so there is a culture supporting academic achievement. Almost every family in CV earns at least part of their living from a scientific pursuit, which I think is a positive thing.. There are a lot of businesses that support the activities that the kids want to do (dance, sports etc). Seems pretty easy to understand. Others may make different choices - but its not hard to understand.

Submitted by The-Shoveler on May 9, 2015 - 8:29am.

IMO CV is where good parents go to suffer for the sake of their kid's.

But I truly don't get this one, why not just buy a few weeks time share in Hawaii LOL.

Submitted by applejack on May 9, 2015 - 10:49am.

I didn't understand the appeal of places like Carmel Valley and Scripps Ranch until I had school-age kids. Now that I do, these areas make total sense to me: peace of mind of knowing your kids are at great schools and that their peers will be similarly motivated. Also, the convenience of not having to drive them long distances for good schools, sports and lessons. CV has the added advantage of being very close to the coast and SV tech jobs. If you have 2-3+ kids, the advantages compound.

As far as this timeshare in CV is concerned, my guess is that it would look attractive to someone that lives in a very cold place (like Toronto) to come hang out at a 5 star resort in San Diego every winter.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on May 9, 2015 - 12:35pm.

njtosd wrote:
svelte wrote:
I have no desire to live in Carmel Valley. It's another one of those places I just don't understand.

Well - it's not a place I would live if I didn't have school aged kids. But since I do, Carmel Valley is easy to understand. Schools are routinely ranked top in the county (son attends CCA which, last I checked, has the highest test scores in SD, plus an arts conservatory, etc). Motivated kids attract good teachers. Low crime, close to the ocean. Almost all the other residents have school aged kids, so there's a good likelihood that your kids will have friends living close. Most of those kids are VERY academically motivated, so there is a culture supporting academic achievement. Almost every family in CV earns at least part of their living from a scientific pursuit, which I think is a positive thing.. There are a lot of businesses that support the activities that the kids want to do (dance, sports etc). Seems pretty easy to understand. Others may make different choices - but its not hard to understand.

I hate to admit it. But if I had kids, I'd live in Carmel valley too.
As far as suburbs go, it's very well located.

Submitted by flyer on May 9, 2015 - 3:47pm.

When my wife and I grew up in LJ, there was no CV, or many of the places people now call home around San Diego.

At that time, (we're in our 50's) no one believed anyone would want to live "out in the "middle of nowhere":) Of course, since then, times have changed, and "nowhere" became a great "somewhere."

We've lived in a lot of places in the world, but when we lived in CV our kids loved it, and we loved the community, the friends we made, the schools, accessibility to I-5--without going too far north--shopping, etc., and, especially the beaches.

Even though we've now been in RSF for years, we couldn't live without our super easy access to the TP or DM beaches and restaurants along the coast. It's definitely all about personal choices, but for all of those reasons and more, I understand why people want to live in CV.

Submitted by fun4vnay2 on May 9, 2015 - 6:55pm.

I have school going kids and I'd like them to be going to above average schools not the top ranking schools or the bottom of the barrel
If my kids are smart enough they'd make it to decent college and that too with scholarship.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on May 10, 2015 - 11:14am.

rockingtime wrote:
I have school going kids and I'd like them to be going to above average schools not the top ranking schools or the bottom of the barrel
If my kids are smart enough they'd make it to decent college and that too with scholarship.

But what happens if your kids are just average or below average? They're more likely to be influenced by the other kids.

Submitted by SK in CV on May 10, 2015 - 11:40am.

FlyerInHi wrote:
rockingtime wrote:
I have school going kids and I'd like them to be going to above average schools not the top ranking schools or the bottom of the barrel
If my kids are smart enough they'd make it to decent college and that too with scholarship.

But what happens if your kids are just average or below average? They're more likely to be influenced by the other kids.

And that influence would be good. Much better for average kids to be in an environment where academic achievement is a good thing, than where it's a bad thing. (And yes, there really are schools where the social environment discourages achievement.)

Submitted by FlyerInHi on May 10, 2015 - 2:45pm.

That's exactly it, SK. Smart kids can thrive despite the environment. The quality of education is more important to average kids.

Submitted by joec on May 10, 2015 - 5:16pm.

FlyerInHi wrote:
That's exactly it, SK. Smart kids can thrive despite the environment. The quality of education is more important to average kids.

The problem is if you had kids, their expected competition gets watered down or is weaker in a moderate or middle of the road school where at a top tier school, they know tons of people are smarter in every which way from being entrepreneurial, tech, medicine, charity, academics, etc...

If your kids are also super smart, the poorer performing schools will not have the resources for your kid since they have far fewer dollars as mentioned in tons of articles that all the schools now have their own foundations and fundraising so your kid will not be able to challenge themselves and will possibly even get bored leading to hanging out with trouble makers, etc...

Like in sports, a high school all star maybe nothing in college and a college all american may never get to the next level.

All in all, I think people with kids should go to the best schools possible for not just the academics, but also for the parents, discipline, money in those schools, the teachers (care more since they aren't dealing with crap kids all day), simply more resources day in day out. I have talked to teachers in other districts and they say it's night and day in terms of fundraising and resources some poorer school areas get.

This is why schools are such a big factor in lots of areas and why housing doesn't drop much in those areas.

Submitted by fun4vnay2 on May 10, 2015 - 5:23pm.

I guess that's where parents' involvements come into play.

Parents wont let school dictate everything for their kids.

I think it also has a lot to do with your own value system as well.

Submitted by flyer on May 10, 2015 - 6:17pm.

As someone who has seen how this all plays out, (since my kids are grown) it does seems that going to "good schools" (as defined in other posts) does make a difference for the majority of students. Of course, there are always exceptions that can be argued both ways.

Even then, I can tell you that, regardless of what schools your kids go to, or how smart they are, the (now global) competition is fierce, and there are a ton of other variables that will ultimately determine their level of success.

When my kids were competing for their career positions, they found that most of their competitors had similar top notch academic backgrounds, and the determining factors in hiring them included far more than academic achievement.

Submitted by scaredyclassic on May 10, 2015 - 6:25pm.

API wise I don't think any of these fancy sd. schools are more than a few points better than Temecula ca.'s great oak hs.

It seems like temecula would be filled with a bunch of redneck morons if you didnt know better but the students here are serious hardcore academics and kick as athletes.

Submitted by flyer on May 10, 2015 - 7:34pm.

It's true that we can all spew API and other stats all day long to give us some indication of "predictable success," but, in the end, the only answer that counts is how well the kids do when they get out in the real world.

Submitted by an on May 10, 2015 - 7:44pm.

I'd love to see stats of 7+ figure net worth and the HS they graduated from. I'd also love to see divorce rates and suicide rates too.

Submitted by flyer on May 10, 2015 - 7:47pm.

That would be interesting, AN. I'm sure it's available somewhere. Thankfully, we all only have to worry about our own kids success and happiness.

Submitted by scaredyclassic on May 10, 2015 - 8:37pm.

hs is not preparatory for life

Submitted by njtosd on May 10, 2015 - 9:22pm.

AN wrote:
I'd love to see stats of 7+ figure net worth and the HS they graduated from. I'd also love to see divorce rates and suicide rates too.

Probably much more correlated to parental achievements and outcomes than those of high school classmates. I am a firm believer in the power of genetics. Hard to tease out, though, as successful parents will often raise their children in above average school districts. Freakonomics has a couple of great articles that relate to this point. For example, academic achievement is correlated to the number of books in a home .....even if the children living there don't read the books. Reason: Smart parents tend to buy more books and also tend to have smart kids. I am beginning to understand where calvin's idea of predestination came from (although i don't subscribe to the philosophy). Also - there was a finding that kids who watched "Baby Einstein" videos ended up achieving less well academically than those who didn't watch. I have my theories about that one - ie low achieving parents more interested in pushing smart baby toys on their children. Nature seems to trump nurture in many instances ....

Submitted by an on May 10, 2015 - 10:52pm.

njtosd wrote:
Probably much more correlated to parental achievements and outcomes than those of high school classmates. I am a firm believer in the power of genetics. Hard to tease out, though, as successful parents will often raise their children in above average school districts. Freakonomics has a couple of great articles that relate to this point. For example, academic achievement is correlated to the number of books in a home .....even if the children living there don't read the books. Reason: Smart parents tend to buy more books and also tend to have smart kids. I am beginning to understand where calvin's idea of predestination came from (although i don't subscribe to the philosophy). Also - there was a finding that kids who watched "Baby Einstein" videos ended up achieving less well academically than those who didn't watch. I have my theories about that one - ie low achieving parents more interested in pushing smart baby toys on their children. Nature seems to trump nurture in many instances ....
I agree with everything you said. But I don't have data to back it up, which is why I would love to see these kind of data. I'm a big believer of nature trump nurture too, but I do think nurture does bring out the best in what nature allow.
I'm wondering, assuming the same parents and the same kids, would the kids perform best in Carmel Valley with both parents working long hours or in much less expensive areas and have one parent stay at home and be extremely involved in the children's education. I'm sure there no data to back up either side, but would be an interesting study.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on May 10, 2015 - 11:07pm.

I feel like scaredy's whole family is of superior intellect.
Scaredy, don't you have lots of books in piles eveywhere?

Submitted by flyer on May 11, 2015 - 5:45am.

Agree these facets of life are very important. My wife flooded our home with books, musical instruments, easels, and every other creative option she could imagine, and our kids loved it. Balancing these aspects of life with all of the many others seemed to really enhance all of our lives.

Concerning the question of how children are effected by having one parent at home vs. both parents working, I haven't researched the stats, but when our kids were growing up in CV, most of the moms in our neighborhood stayed at home with their kids.

Although most were educated professionals, these women chose to either work from home or not work at all. Their husbands were MD's, college prof's, newscasters, CPA's, attorneys, pilots, business owners, sports figures etc. We pretty much found the same to be true when we moved to RSF.

As far as the success rate of our kids, I would have to say about 50% achieved the goals they set when they entered college. I really don't know how revealing such a small sample is, but it is interesting.

Submitted by scaredyclassic on May 11, 2015 - 6:23am.

By all means, marry. If you get a good wife, you'll become happy; if you get a bad one, you'll become a philosopher.
Socrates.

by all means, attempt to succeed in life. If it works, you'll be happy. if you fail, you'll become a philosopher.

scaredy,

Submitted by poorgradstudent on May 11, 2015 - 11:20am.

svelte wrote:
I have no desire to live in Carmel Valley. It's another one of those places I just don't understand.

Fairly close to the ocean. Good schools. Easy access to Sorrento Valley, where I work.

That said, the bang for the buck isn't great, and I doubt we'll ever actually live there. I can see the appeal, just can't justify the price premium for that appeal.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on May 11, 2015 - 11:43am.

flyer wrote:

As far as the success rate of our kids, I would have to say about 50% achieved the goals they set when they entered college. I really don't know how revealing such a small sample is, but it is interesting.

What is the success rates of your kids friends? You said you've seen people leave San Diego in search of opportunities. I'm assuming they didn't want to leave but left.
I agree with you that living where you want to live is key. What is the percentage who can do that?

Submitted by FlyerInHi on May 11, 2015 - 11:55am.

scaredyclassic wrote:
By all means, marry. If you get a good wife, you'll become happy; if you get a bad one, you'll become a philosopher.
Socrates.

by all means, attempt to succeed in life. If it works, you'll be happy. if you fail, you'll become a philosopher.

scaredy,

Becoming a philosopher is great success.

I'm not a Buddhist but in their philosophy there are different stages of zen. Everyone can achieve the ultimate.

Submitted by deadzone on May 11, 2015 - 12:23pm.

poorgradstudent wrote:
svelte wrote:
I have no desire to live in Carmel Valley. It's another one of those places I just don't understand.

Fairly close to the ocean. Good schools. Easy access to Sorrento Valley, where I work.

That said, the bang for the buck isn't great, and I doubt we'll ever actually live there. I can see the appeal, just can't justify the price premium for that appeal.

For the price I don't get it either. For those prices, could live in parts of La Jolla or other areas close to the ocean with a little more character. On the other hand, if you are only worried about schools (which is overrated in my opinion), you could live in a place like Scripps Ranch which is nice but also has no personality.

By the way, agree with other posters that the test scores of these schools is a bit overrated. Number one factor in child's academic success by far is genetics. Second place in my opinion is parental involvement. Choice of school is distant third.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on May 11, 2015 - 2:08pm.

Seems to me camel valley are not just about good schools with high API like in any other part of the country.
It's next to a UC, the tech/biotech golden triangle. You have kids whose parents work in competitive fields that require intelligence. Great diversity in a pleasant, upscale, beach close environment. Easy to understand the premium.

Submitted by flyer on May 11, 2015 - 3:38pm.

FIH, when I said "our kids," I meant our own kids and their friends in the sample group I mentioned regarding the 50% success rate.

Our own kids and many of our friends kids have achieved the goals they
set--many have not--so imo, no academic system comes with an iron-clad guarantee of success in life, and that was my point. In the final analysis, All each of us can do is try to make sure our own kids get where they want to be.

Also, definitely agree living where you want to live is key for many reasons. We're very happy with the choices we've made, and I hope others are as well.

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