Anybody plan on upgrading to windows 10 on Wednesday?

Submitted by moneymaker on July 28, 2015 - 7:51pm
Yes!
29% (6 votes)
No!
52% (11 votes)
Maybe
19% (4 votes)
Total votes: 21
Submitted by spdrun on July 28, 2015 - 8:03pm.

Fuck no! I don't want an OS that attempts to shove cloud usage down my raw oesophagus. Don't want OneDrive, don't want a Microsoft account, don't want to yapp at Cortana like a schizo. Stop nudging me. My data are mine and will be stored locally. Or at least on an encrypted cloud provider of MY choice.

Deleted all "GWX" folders when the bitchy little nag showed on in my system tray, so I don't know if it's even possible to upgrade at this point.

My next "upgrade" will likely be to some variant of Ubuntu. Not a (computer) gamer, so don't really care about availability of games.

Submitted by moneymaker on July 28, 2015 - 9:42pm.

I got 5.5GB in a hidden filing waiting to install.

Submitted by Hatfield on July 28, 2015 - 10:37pm.

Wow. I run Win 7 in a virtual machine in OSX, and it'll be easy enough to make a copy of the VM before doing the upgrade. Not planning on doing it right away though.

Submitted by an on July 28, 2015 - 11:13pm.

Have been running Windows 10 for about 6 months. Best Windows to date.

Submitted by moneymaker on July 29, 2015 - 6:35am.

ok, now that it has downloaded, anybody know how to get it to self install?

Submitted by ocrenter on July 29, 2015 - 7:28am.

AN wrote:
Have been running Windows 10 for about 6 months. Best Windows to date.

that's what I keep seeing online. Looks like I'll be getting off the fence on this one and go for it.

Too bad Windows Media Center is no more with Windows 10, will have to keep the computer in the living room using Windows 7.

Submitted by ltsddd on July 29, 2015 - 7:57am.

moneymaker wrote:
ok, now that it has downloaded, anybody know how to get it to self install?

You might have to burn it to a cd/dvd as an iso image.

Submitted by kev374 on July 29, 2015 - 8:09am.

I will because I have Windows 8.1 and anything else must be better than this crap of an OS. Windows XP and 7 were just fine I don't know why they had to go and screw everything up!

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 8:14am.

7 is supported till 2019 or so -- you can always downgrade 8.1 to 7 Pro.

Submitted by poorgradstudent on July 29, 2015 - 9:00am.

The reality is these days you should just wait a while after the release for them to work out the bugs before upgrading. And if your current OS works fine on your hardware, there's no point in rushing to upgrade.

Submitted by Coronita on July 29, 2015 - 9:29am.

Damnit, I just finished reimaging my Windows 8...

So what happened to Windows 9?? :)

Submitted by Coronita on July 29, 2015 - 9:39am.

Alright. I'll give this a shot once I get a CD image... I'm running Win 8 from VmWare. And I suppose I can upgrade the O/S to Win 10 to see if it breaks anything...

Submitted by an on July 29, 2015 - 10:13am.

The update happens through Windows Update, so you don't need to burn it on any DVD or anything.

Submitted by an on July 29, 2015 - 10:15am.

ocrenter wrote:
AN wrote:
Have been running Windows 10 for about 6 months. Best Windows to date.

that's what I keep seeing online. Looks like I'll be getting off the fence on this one and go for it.

Too bad Windows Media Center is no more with Windows 10, will have to keep the computer in the living room using Windows 7.

I stopped using Windows Media Center a long time ago, so it doesn't bother me. If if you need that, then you're right, stick with Windows 7. I use Plex for my media streaming.

Submitted by livinincali on July 29, 2015 - 10:18am.

poorgradstudent wrote:
The reality is these days you should just wait a while after the release for them to work out the bugs before upgrading. And if your current OS works fine on your hardware, there's no point in rushing to upgrade.

With windows you can usually just wait until the next major version after a redesign. Win 2000 crap -> Win XP pretty good. Vista crap -> windows 7 pretty good, Windows 2008 crap -> Windows 10 probably good.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 10:56am.

The update happens through Windows Update, so you don't need to burn it on any DVD or anything.

A clean install is generally better than an upgrade, and it would be nice to have an install DVD for future use if (say) the HDD/SSD craps out.

Here's the link to the final Windows 10 .iso image.
http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/y...

The only question is, what product key to use -- will it accept an existing Windows 7 key? Or will you have to upgrade to Windows 10 and save the key that it generates first?

EDIT: supposedly, once an upgrade is installed, the .iso install will recognize the same hardware and install without a key if needed. Creepy that M$ is storing people's hardware profiles online somewhere or modifying firmware in some way.

Submitted by Coronita on July 29, 2015 - 10:47am.

AN wrote:
The update happens through Windows Update, so you don't need to burn it on any DVD or anything.

I'd like to create a brand new VM instance and then try it on a separate instance before I do anything to my real instance.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 10:54am.

^^^ see above for .iso. You can probably get a temp key that works for 30 days or a crack if you don't want to buy the real key for a new instance.

Looks like there are several ways to install a trial without a key.

Submitted by an on July 29, 2015 - 10:56am.

flu wrote:
AN wrote:
The update happens through Windows Update, so you don't need to burn it on any DVD or anything.

I'd like to create a brand new VM instance and then try it on a separate instance before I do anything to my real instance.


Go here to download the download too: http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-...

You can have it put on a flash drive, then you can do a clean Windows 10 install. You just need your Windows 7/8/8.1 key to activate it.

This is essentially will be the last Windows "version". From now on, update will come out frequently and to all users. You will continuously get new features as they implement them and no longer need to buy a new version of Windows to get them.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 11:02am.

That's interesting, but also dangerous. It seems like a way for M$ to gradually push users to being forced to use their paid services. Like boiling a frog.

Fortunately, creativity is unparalleled, and I'm sure there will be ways to kill off updates entirely, or pick and choose.

Submitted by Coronita on July 29, 2015 - 11:05am.

AN wrote:
flu wrote:
AN wrote:
The update happens through Windows Update, so you don't need to burn it on any DVD or anything.

I'd like to create a brand new VM instance and then try it on a separate instance before I do anything to my real instance.


Go here to download the download too: http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-...

You can have it put on a flash drive, then you can do a clean Windows 10 install. You just need your Windows 7/8/8.1 key to activate it.

This is essentially will be the last Windows "version". From now on, update will come out frequently and to all users. You will continuously get new features as they implement them and no longer need to buy a new version of Windows to get them.

What's the catch? :)

Is this really free free, or "microsoft free"?

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 11:15am.

It's only free for existing Windows 7/8/8.1 devices. New devices will pay up to $200 for a license, depending on version and OEM status.

Also, who's to say that new "features" won't require a monthly mordida to MS in order to work? Maybe a MS or Office 365 account with a credit card number if you please. Bend over. Spread your cheeks, and act like you like it.

They're already playing with adware, with a small annual fee to remove the ads. Sounds like the soft version of a Mafia tactic:

http://www.businessinsider.com/solitaire...

Submitted by an on July 29, 2015 - 11:39am.

flu wrote:
AN wrote:
flu wrote:
AN wrote:
The update happens through Windows Update, so you don't need to burn it on any DVD or anything.

I'd like to create a brand new VM instance and then try it on a separate instance before I do anything to my real instance.


Go here to download the download too: http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-...

You can have it put on a flash drive, then you can do a clean Windows 10 install. You just need your Windows 7/8/8.1 key to activate it.

This is essentially will be the last Windows "version". From now on, update will come out frequently and to all users. You will continuously get new features as they implement them and no longer need to buy a new version of Windows to get them.

What's the catch? :)

Is this really free free, or "microsoft free"?

AFAIK, it's truly free. They did the math and see that most people don't upgrade, so with Windows 10 Home, they will actually to auto update, so you can't even say no to the update. There will be constant security updates. All the apps are decoupled from the OS, so those will also be updated through the store. New apps/features will also be pushed through the store, so once you have Windows 10, you'll be getting new features as they get created, even ones that will be created 10 years from now.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 11:45am.

Fortunately, Windows has a huge software ecosystem. Chances are, there will be an aftermarket solution to stop Microsoft from auto-installing intrusive updates and misfeatures inside of six months.

The nuclear option is likely as simple as routing the update servers to 127.0.0.1 in the hosts file, but that's not selective. Some level of selectivity (similar to what exists currently) would be ideal.

EDIT: looks like MS itself is backpedaling and implementing similar update management as in older versions for those who need it. Good...

http://www.wired.com/2015/07/stop-window...

Submitted by an on July 29, 2015 - 11:43am.

spdrun wrote:
That's interesting, but also dangerous. It seems like a way for M$ to gradually push users to being forced to use their paid services. Like boiling a frog.

Fortunately, creativity is unparalleled, and I'm sure there will be ways to kill off updates entirely, or pick and choose.

M$? Seriously? Is this 1999?

They're doing this because they know the world is changing. It's all about users and apps. The more users they have, the more apps will be written for them platform, which mean more profit they can make from the purchase of those apps through the store. Currently, people don't really upgrade very quickly anyways. They're still charging OEM for the license, so, they're not losing very much to move to this business model.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 11:55am.

Of course THEY don't lose much. Users lose a lot. Privacy, since MS will try to ram cloud storage down their gullets. And each account will be tied to a credit card number and identifying info if users don't wish to be forced to watch ads.

I'd rather pay a higher one-time fee for a system that doesn't nickle and dime me while invading my privacy. Right now, Windows 7 with SSH, SFTP clients, OpenOffice, Thunderbird mail, GIMP for photos, etc fits my needs nicely. And will likely continue to do so for the next few years.

I bought a fucking license. I own it. I don't want to be nickle and dimed for the next decade or two.

It would be nice if the PNW fault finally lets go and levels a large portion of Redmond :) Ideally when Microsoft's CEO is in town.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on July 29, 2015 - 11:49am.

What are the main differences between Home and Pro?

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 11:52am.

The usual ... Pro has remote desktop, ability to join a corp domain, ability to delay updates.

Submitted by an on July 29, 2015 - 12:03pm.

spdrun wrote:
Of course THEY don't lose much. Users lose a lot.
User like you lose a lot. But you can keep on buying Windows 7 or switch over to Ubuntu. But you're in the minority. I have Office 365 and 1TB of OneDrive and love it. Most of my data are on there and I have access to those files regardless of which ever computer I'm on. I no longer need to worry about my HDD dying and losing data. So, definitely different strokes for different folks, but my bet is, the majority of the user will find this direction more desirable.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 12:11pm.

Well, if you want to be a sheep, more power to you. I'm not opposed to cloud storage, but I want to pick and choose what I use, and have the data be protected by an encryption key known only to myself and my devices. Not just a user name and password. OneDrive doesn't have that ability as implemented.

But none of this speaks to Microsoft's trying to push ads on users of their system. Do you really think that paying $10/yr to have video ad spam removed from a given app benefits users? $10/yr doesn't sound like much, until you realize that there might be different fees for different software, and it will add up.

Even $100/yr will mean users essentially paying for a new license every year. Fuck that idea with a turbocharged jackhammer.

But I guess the average sheep user deserves what they get. A punch in the neck.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on July 29, 2015 - 12:14pm.

AN wrote:
spdrun wrote:
Of course THEY don't lose much. Users lose a lot.
User like you lose a lot. But you can keep on buying Windows 7 or switch over to Ubuntu. But you're in the minority. I have Office 365 and 1TB of OneDrive and love it. Most of my data are on there and I have access to those files regardless of which ever computer I'm on. I no longer need to worry about my HDD dying and losing data. So, definitely different strokes for different folks, but my bet is, the majority of the user will find this direction more desirable.

I have to say that I agree with AN. Windows 10 is the path of least resistance for convenience and expediency. I just windows 8.1 with one drive and love the convenience.

But spd is right too. It's creepy. Someone (like the NSA/CIA/FBI) might have access to your files and know everything about your life.

sdp, the business model for pretty much everything these days is subscription (ie small monthly fees).

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 12:15pm.

Backing up to encrypted cloud or an external device automatically is child's play these days.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on July 29, 2015 - 12:17pm.

spdrun wrote:
Backing up to encrypted cloud or an external device automatically is child's play these days.

Inconvenient. Windows with OneDrive does it for you. Everything moves seamlessly across devices.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 12:23pm.

I'd take privacy over convenience. Besides, the subset of files that I use on different devices is typically different anyway. The only thing that's really shared is email, via a private "Hillarybox" not any of the big providers.

There's also no technical reason why OneDrive couldn't have an option of working with purely local (pw protected) encryption keys and encrypt before moving data. But MS wants access to your private information, so they don't make it an option.

Submitted by Coronita on July 29, 2015 - 12:21pm.

FlyerInHi wrote:
AN wrote:
spdrun wrote:
Of course THEY don't lose much. Users lose a lot.
User like you lose a lot. But you can keep on buying Windows 7 or switch over to Ubuntu. But you're in the minority. I have Office 365 and 1TB of OneDrive and love it. Most of my data are on there and I have access to those files regardless of which ever computer I'm on. I no longer need to worry about my HDD dying and losing data. So, definitely different strokes for different folks, but my bet is, the majority of the user will find this direction more desirable.

I have to say that I agree with AN. Windows 10 is the path of least resistance for convenience and expediency. I just windows 8.1 with one drive and love the convenience.

But spd is right too. It's creepy. Someone (like the NSA/CIA/FBI) might have access to your files and know everything about your life.

sdp, the business model for pretty much everything these days is subscription (ie small monthly fees).

Chances are, they already do.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on July 29, 2015 - 12:23pm.

yes, but the old way of doing business would cause MS to go bankrupt.

Young people don't think of hardware/software. They just want computing devices that work and provide them access to everything they need.

spd, there's a niche market for people like you to be serviced my small companies. Microsoft isn't the company to provide what you want.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 12:34pm.

The privacy issues doesn't address their ability to nickle and dime you and extort money to remove video ad spam. Not even regular ads. Ads that actually eat significant bandwidth.

I disagree about MS going bankrupt with the old way of business. (Assuming they refrain from doing stupid things like buying failing cell phone makers ;) )

Apple is strict about adware and subscription apps and they're doing fine. I'm pretty sure they'd NEVER build ad spam into iOS or OS X. Come to think of it, Google doesn't do it either on stock builds of Android.

I'd disagree about younger people wanting things like that. If anything, they're more hardware and software savvy, and more attuned to the political issues around data.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on July 29, 2015 - 12:55pm.

The young people I know don't care really.

The old fashioned folks (mostly men) are the ones who used to build their own computers. Who like to customize everyhing.

I think Apple was brilliant with their devices and Genius Bar for dummies. Customers felt valued with support.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 1:12pm.

Not a question of customization as much as privacy. Maybe I just happen to know people who are unusually political.

The question also has to be posed in the right way.

"Do you want x in the cloud?" vs
"Do you want every x you created to be stored on y's servers versus being on your device?"

The term "cloud" is meaningless to a lot of people. It's been pitched by advertising and PR scum as a form of synchronization, while avoiding the uncomfortable reality of how/where the data are stored.

It's like:
"Do you want OnStar?" "Sure. Feature. Squeeeee!"
"Do you want GM to be able to track your car's location?" "Uhhh, what?"

Submitted by FlyerInHi on July 29, 2015 - 1:20pm.

Do you want all your pictures, bookmarks and files on all your devices?
It's magic and only available on our platform.

How does it work?
The devices sync automatically on our easy to use platform. If you have any questions we can set it up for you at our Genius Bar.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 1:21pm.

Exactly. It's all about the phrasing.

Submitted by an on July 29, 2015 - 1:46pm.

What video ads are you talking about? I don't see any video ads, except for when I want to watch a video on YouTube.

As for Apple, they make their profit on the devices. They're a device company that have software. Microsoft and Google doesn't really do much hardware like Apple. So comparing the two is illogical.

Anyways, different strokes for different folks. I operate on the fact that I don't have anything to hide, so I want ultimate convenience. Which is also why Apple is doing so well. Make it simple for average users. Now, Microsoft is trying to go one step further and make it easy for you to use their service, regardless of if you're using iPhone, Android, Windows Phone, OSX, or Windows. Any combination of those will work too.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 1:47pm.

Not illogical at all -- MS and Apple aren't really different. MS will still collect a one-time license fee per new Windows device. If anything, their costs are lower since they don't have to support hardware.

Supposedly some of the ads are video-based, not just displayed as images.

Submitted by an on July 29, 2015 - 1:53pm.

spdrun wrote:
Not illogical at all -- MS and Apple aren't really different. MS will still collect a one-time license fee per new Windows device. If anything, their costs are lower since they don't have to support hardware.

Supposedly some of the ads are video-based, not just displayed as images.

Apple makes big profit on their hardware, so they can subsidize their software. Microsoft doesn't have a hardware cash cow to lean on. But regardless, people are voting with their wallet, which is why Windows will now be free. They're hoping to make up the profit on the back end with app sales.

What ads are you talking about? Where are the ads? I don't see any ads. Care to back up your assertion that Win10 is full of ads?

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 2:06pm.

I'm saying they're using their included games pack as a trial balloon for bundling ads with other Windows components.

As far as Apple vs MS, Microsoft also doesn't have hardware support/development costs and sales of their OS on the desktop are also larger than Apple's.

Submitted by an on July 29, 2015 - 2:13pm.

Again, what ads?

Submitted by FlyerInHi on July 29, 2015 - 2:55pm.

I just downloaded the iso and made a disk.
I will do a clean install on my desktop later, the one that I use to scan all my paperwork.

BTW, what's the best way to make pdf for archiving purposes (small pdf, most space saving files) I don't like to pay Adobe.

Submitted by spdrun on July 29, 2015 - 3:06pm.

Newer versions of Office can export in PDF.

If you're scanning, many scanner drivers can scan directly to PDF. Some scanners will even scan directly to a network folder and deposit a PDF there!

Though unless you do OCR on the scanned documents first, the PDF will likely be larger than (say) a Word document, since the computer will see it as a giant graphic, not as typeset text.

Submitted by FlyerInHi on July 29, 2015 - 3:07pm.

The scanner softwares suck. I found they make bigger, less efficient pdf files.

Submitted by Coronita on July 29, 2015 - 5:27pm.

Not bad on my old old MacBook running VMWare on Ubuntu 14 ....win10

Hm... Maybe I'll keep it...
Yeah yeah, I know. Ubuntu on a Macbook... Why??? I don't know. Because I can...